Hall of Fame Pyramid - Honorable Mention Third Basemen
Apr 3, 2019 19:23:52 GMT -5
RandyP, Rich - Former GM, and 2 more like this
Post by sansterre - Milwaukee Brewers on Apr 3, 2019 19:23:52 GMT -5
Perhaps the first modern third baseman, Jimmy Collins! Collins came up in the 1890s as an outfielder but was transitioned to third base. According to a number of narrative histories, Collins was the first third basemen to field bunts by charging the ball and throwing across his body to first instead of stopping to plant his feet. This was a game-changer at the time, as bunts were very common and no one to that point had developed this technique. It’s interesting to remember that much of what we take for granted as far as tactics and strategy in the modern game were incredibly new at in the 1890s. There’s a famous story of a 20 year-old Honus Wagner in one of his first major league games being asked to “lay one down”. Wagner went to the plate and hit a home run. When his manager, Fred Clarke, asked him why he’d ignored the instruction Wagner admitted that he had no idea what “lay one down” meant. Things like charging bunts or playing off of first were innovations at the time.
Anyhow, back to Collins. He was not a terribly dominant hitter; his OPS+ of 113 is fourth-last among third basemen in this building. His career line of 294/343/409 bespeaks good contact, good gap power and that’s about it (of course, home run power hadn’t been invented yet). Collins’ main claim to fame, as you might guess, was his fielding which was worth +121 runs over his career, 9th in this building for his position. These combine to give him a JONS of 31.2. His peak was relatively narrow; between 1897 and 1905 he put up seven seasons above 4 WAR, including two 6+. He was a key cog on the Boston Americans team that won the first World Series. But outside of that eight-season window he put up 7.7 WAR total. His 7447 plate appearances bespeak his short career. He and Bill Bradley were first two great third basemen in baseball history, and Collins was the better of them.
Skipping six decades, we have Ron Cey! Cey was the third-baseman for the excellent Dodgers’ infields of the 70s. He broke in at 25 in 1973 and played with the Dodgers until 1982, then played for the Cubs and A’s until he retired in 1987. In his relatively short career of 8344 plate appearances he averaged an OPS+ of 121 with an average glove, worth a JONS of 31.2. An OPS+ higher than 120 is quite good for a skill-infielder but his career batting line is curiously low: 261/354/445. You must remember two things: his era had somewhat depressed scoring and he played in Dodger Stadium. That’s one of the beautiful things about OPS+; it cuts across eras and parks. He was as good a hitter (adjusted for these things) as Paul Molitor, Scott Rolen or Israel Hinojosa, you just wouldn’t have known because of his park and era.
His top tens paint the appropriate picture of his skills. Six for WAR, nine for home runs, four for walks and four for striking out a lot. He struck out because he took a lot of pitches, walked enough to make his OBP good even with a low average, and hit a goodly number of home runs. He never hit more than 30, and only hit 316 over his career, but again, his era and park work against him. Put him in Coors field in the late-90s run environment and he’d probably hit 500 home runs with room to spare. He made six All-Stars and won a ring, in 1981 over the Yankees. He won the World Series MVP that year, and overall hit 261/362/441 in the playoffs, actually better than his regular averages. Cey’s six seasons at 4.9 WAR or above is very solid, but his era and park really hurt his superficial appearance. In reality, Cey was an extremely good player and deserves to be in this building.
Playing at the same time, Darryl Evans! Evans was like Cey’s doppleganger in a lot of ways; both walked a lot with considerable power, but had low batting average, causing each to be underrated. In fact, Evans was even more underrated than Cey was. Evans had an OPS+ of 119 over 10737 plate appearances (comparable to Cey but with a longer career) and was actually a slightly better fielder (+37 runs vs. +19 runs). Yet he only made two All-Star games in his career. There are two main reasons for this: the first is that Cey played on the routinely excellent Dodgers where Evans played for the 70s Braves and the late 70s early 80s Giants, neither of whom were particularly good. In fact, Evans never played in the playoffs until the age of 37. The second reason is that unlike Cey, who was routinely really good, Evans had two monster seasons and everything after was more mid-range.
His career line was 248/361/431; he finished top ten in home runs six times and in walks an incredible fifteen times (finishing first in the league once and twice, respectively). In his two super seasons he hit 281/403/556 and 240/381/419 with gold-glove caliber defense, finishing with a 9.0 WAR (2nd in the league behind Joe Morgan) and 7.2 WAR (5th). In each season he led the league in walks. But those two were his peak; he also had four 4-WAR seasons and another five 3-WAR seasons afterwards. He didn’t hit for much average, but he walked a ton, had quality power and in his prime was an excellent fielder. It’s sad that he didn’t get much love in his day; his JONS of 32.9 suggests that he would have deserved it.
Starting when Evans and Cey were retiring, Robin Ventura! Ventura had an unusually short career for somebody who was starting in the majors by 22 (1990 for the White Sox). He only played in 155+ games six times and was on his way out by 35. He only made two All-Star teams, but won six Gold Gloves (deservedly so, with +155 fielding runs, 6th at his position in this building) over his 8271 plate appearances where he averaged an OPS+ of 114. The OPS+ is interesting since his slash stats (267/362/444) look pretty comparable to Cey and Evans, but his OPS+ indicates that he was a worse hitter. Of course, Ventura played in the 90s and early 2000s, which was a much friendlier environment for hitters. This is shown by his top tens; even though he walked about as much as Cey or Evans he’s only in three top tens for walks, as batters were taking more and more walks in his era. Likewise, even though he hit 30+ home runs twice he never finished in the top ten for jacks. Ultimately Ventura was a decent contact hitter with respectable doubles and home run power who walked a lot and was an exceptional fielder. He managed to finish above 5+ WAR five times; he deserved more than only two All-Star games. But his relatively short career keeps his JONS to 31.7 which is really good, but nowhere near good enough for Bronze.
The best Honorable Mention Third-Base hitter, Adrian Cardenas! Cardenas was a starter for Oakland by 2012 (at the age of 24) and by age 25 he started a streak of 2.9+ WAR seasons that didn’t end until he was 36. His batting line of 283/358/475 is all the more notable when you consider that he played in Oakland, and when he got tired of playing in that pitchers’ park, he went to play for the Dodgers. His career OPS+ of 126 puts him as the 13th best hitting third baseman ever, and that he kept it up over 12285 plate appearances (he retired at 42) is even more impressive. He was an average fielder but his bat did all the talking for him, with top tens that include hits (4), total bases (3), home runs (3), RBI’s (led the league twice), and WAR five times. His high average (hit 300+ five times and that’s in Oakland and LA) was fueled by his incredible bat control, striking out only 13.5% of the time. He made seven All-Stars, had three 6+ WAR years, another three 5’s, another three 4’s, finishing with a JONS of 39.3, right on the cusp of Bronze. If he fell short anywhere it’s that his fielding was only average and he never had a super-dominant peak, topping out with 6.9 WAR in 2018. Few players come as close to Bronze as Adrian Cardenas did.
A roller-coaster of performance, Israel Hinojosa! Taken in the supplemental round of the first round by the Angels, Hinojosa was traded three times before he hit the majors for the Cubs at age 22. His first three years in the majors were modest; he took a lot of pitches, walked a lot and fielded well, but didn’t bat above 230 and couldn’t hit 20 home runs. His age 25 season (2022) was like lightning from a clear sky; he hit 289 (his career high), on-based 383 and hit 38 home runs, slugging 550, for a combined package of 7.1 WAR, first in the league and winning him an MVP. It was impossible to know then if this was a fluke, or a sign of future greatness. It turned out to be a bit of both.
Over his career Hinojosa made 7 All-Star games and won a Gold Glove, averaging an OPS+ of 122 over 10030 plate appearances and contributed +39 runs with his glove. His power bloom was real; he hit 400+ home runs over his career (with five top tens). His patience continued, with four top tens in walks. But his contact never really developed; though his strikeouts weren’t terribly high, his uppercut swing rarely got him high batting averages (career 255 hitter). The Cubs traded him to the Giants for a first rounder and there he had the same trend: several modest seasons and one mammoth year, hitting 274/369/496 with 31 home runs and +9 runs with his glove, combining for 7.5 WAR. Hinojosa was inconsistently great; he broke 7 WAR twice, but only had four total seasons above 5 WAR. He finished with a JONS of 35.2; excellent, but not Bronze-worthy.
A recent retiree, Rob “Racehorse” McCoy! McCoy was taken #19 overall by the Yankees in the 2028 draft. By 2030 he was considered the #1 prospect in the PBL. Over his career he was to demonstrate every single skill you’d want in a Hall of Fame player. He took a respectable number of pitches (1000+ walks in his career), made ferocious contact (career 328 BABIP), had respectable power (400+ doubles and 300+ home runs) and played all infield positions well (and truthfully, he was better at second than third). He won four Silver Sluggers, two Gold Gloves, made seven All-Star teams and won one ring (in 2035 with the Yankees). And yet.
He finished with only a 115 OPS+ over 9980 plate appearances, for a JONS of 34.1. What went wrong? Well first, he struck out a ton, never striking out less than 100 times if he started at least 102 games, so his great contact ability only led to a 270 batting average. He on-based 346, which is respectable, and his decent power bought him a modest 431 slugging. He was consistently excellent, with eight different 4+ WAR seasons and two in the 6+ range, but he was never quite as good as it seemed that he ought have been. The exception was the playoffs; over 335 postseason PA’s he hit 303/374/471, including 17 hits and 9 walks in ‘35 en route to the Yankees championship. In the playoffs “Racehorse” McCoy brought it real.
Not too many huh? Don’t worry, there are plenty of Bronze-level third basemen to learn about. Up next, Honorable Mention Shortstops!
Anyhow, back to Collins. He was not a terribly dominant hitter; his OPS+ of 113 is fourth-last among third basemen in this building. His career line of 294/343/409 bespeaks good contact, good gap power and that’s about it (of course, home run power hadn’t been invented yet). Collins’ main claim to fame, as you might guess, was his fielding which was worth +121 runs over his career, 9th in this building for his position. These combine to give him a JONS of 31.2. His peak was relatively narrow; between 1897 and 1905 he put up seven seasons above 4 WAR, including two 6+. He was a key cog on the Boston Americans team that won the first World Series. But outside of that eight-season window he put up 7.7 WAR total. His 7447 plate appearances bespeak his short career. He and Bill Bradley were first two great third basemen in baseball history, and Collins was the better of them.
Skipping six decades, we have Ron Cey! Cey was the third-baseman for the excellent Dodgers’ infields of the 70s. He broke in at 25 in 1973 and played with the Dodgers until 1982, then played for the Cubs and A’s until he retired in 1987. In his relatively short career of 8344 plate appearances he averaged an OPS+ of 121 with an average glove, worth a JONS of 31.2. An OPS+ higher than 120 is quite good for a skill-infielder but his career batting line is curiously low: 261/354/445. You must remember two things: his era had somewhat depressed scoring and he played in Dodger Stadium. That’s one of the beautiful things about OPS+; it cuts across eras and parks. He was as good a hitter (adjusted for these things) as Paul Molitor, Scott Rolen or Israel Hinojosa, you just wouldn’t have known because of his park and era.
His top tens paint the appropriate picture of his skills. Six for WAR, nine for home runs, four for walks and four for striking out a lot. He struck out because he took a lot of pitches, walked enough to make his OBP good even with a low average, and hit a goodly number of home runs. He never hit more than 30, and only hit 316 over his career, but again, his era and park work against him. Put him in Coors field in the late-90s run environment and he’d probably hit 500 home runs with room to spare. He made six All-Stars and won a ring, in 1981 over the Yankees. He won the World Series MVP that year, and overall hit 261/362/441 in the playoffs, actually better than his regular averages. Cey’s six seasons at 4.9 WAR or above is very solid, but his era and park really hurt his superficial appearance. In reality, Cey was an extremely good player and deserves to be in this building.
Playing at the same time, Darryl Evans! Evans was like Cey’s doppleganger in a lot of ways; both walked a lot with considerable power, but had low batting average, causing each to be underrated. In fact, Evans was even more underrated than Cey was. Evans had an OPS+ of 119 over 10737 plate appearances (comparable to Cey but with a longer career) and was actually a slightly better fielder (+37 runs vs. +19 runs). Yet he only made two All-Star games in his career. There are two main reasons for this: the first is that Cey played on the routinely excellent Dodgers where Evans played for the 70s Braves and the late 70s early 80s Giants, neither of whom were particularly good. In fact, Evans never played in the playoffs until the age of 37. The second reason is that unlike Cey, who was routinely really good, Evans had two monster seasons and everything after was more mid-range.
His career line was 248/361/431; he finished top ten in home runs six times and in walks an incredible fifteen times (finishing first in the league once and twice, respectively). In his two super seasons he hit 281/403/556 and 240/381/419 with gold-glove caliber defense, finishing with a 9.0 WAR (2nd in the league behind Joe Morgan) and 7.2 WAR (5th). In each season he led the league in walks. But those two were his peak; he also had four 4-WAR seasons and another five 3-WAR seasons afterwards. He didn’t hit for much average, but he walked a ton, had quality power and in his prime was an excellent fielder. It’s sad that he didn’t get much love in his day; his JONS of 32.9 suggests that he would have deserved it.
Starting when Evans and Cey were retiring, Robin Ventura! Ventura had an unusually short career for somebody who was starting in the majors by 22 (1990 for the White Sox). He only played in 155+ games six times and was on his way out by 35. He only made two All-Star teams, but won six Gold Gloves (deservedly so, with +155 fielding runs, 6th at his position in this building) over his 8271 plate appearances where he averaged an OPS+ of 114. The OPS+ is interesting since his slash stats (267/362/444) look pretty comparable to Cey and Evans, but his OPS+ indicates that he was a worse hitter. Of course, Ventura played in the 90s and early 2000s, which was a much friendlier environment for hitters. This is shown by his top tens; even though he walked about as much as Cey or Evans he’s only in three top tens for walks, as batters were taking more and more walks in his era. Likewise, even though he hit 30+ home runs twice he never finished in the top ten for jacks. Ultimately Ventura was a decent contact hitter with respectable doubles and home run power who walked a lot and was an exceptional fielder. He managed to finish above 5+ WAR five times; he deserved more than only two All-Star games. But his relatively short career keeps his JONS to 31.7 which is really good, but nowhere near good enough for Bronze.
The best Honorable Mention Third-Base hitter, Adrian Cardenas! Cardenas was a starter for Oakland by 2012 (at the age of 24) and by age 25 he started a streak of 2.9+ WAR seasons that didn’t end until he was 36. His batting line of 283/358/475 is all the more notable when you consider that he played in Oakland, and when he got tired of playing in that pitchers’ park, he went to play for the Dodgers. His career OPS+ of 126 puts him as the 13th best hitting third baseman ever, and that he kept it up over 12285 plate appearances (he retired at 42) is even more impressive. He was an average fielder but his bat did all the talking for him, with top tens that include hits (4), total bases (3), home runs (3), RBI’s (led the league twice), and WAR five times. His high average (hit 300+ five times and that’s in Oakland and LA) was fueled by his incredible bat control, striking out only 13.5% of the time. He made seven All-Stars, had three 6+ WAR years, another three 5’s, another three 4’s, finishing with a JONS of 39.3, right on the cusp of Bronze. If he fell short anywhere it’s that his fielding was only average and he never had a super-dominant peak, topping out with 6.9 WAR in 2018. Few players come as close to Bronze as Adrian Cardenas did.
A roller-coaster of performance, Israel Hinojosa! Taken in the supplemental round of the first round by the Angels, Hinojosa was traded three times before he hit the majors for the Cubs at age 22. His first three years in the majors were modest; he took a lot of pitches, walked a lot and fielded well, but didn’t bat above 230 and couldn’t hit 20 home runs. His age 25 season (2022) was like lightning from a clear sky; he hit 289 (his career high), on-based 383 and hit 38 home runs, slugging 550, for a combined package of 7.1 WAR, first in the league and winning him an MVP. It was impossible to know then if this was a fluke, or a sign of future greatness. It turned out to be a bit of both.
Over his career Hinojosa made 7 All-Star games and won a Gold Glove, averaging an OPS+ of 122 over 10030 plate appearances and contributed +39 runs with his glove. His power bloom was real; he hit 400+ home runs over his career (with five top tens). His patience continued, with four top tens in walks. But his contact never really developed; though his strikeouts weren’t terribly high, his uppercut swing rarely got him high batting averages (career 255 hitter). The Cubs traded him to the Giants for a first rounder and there he had the same trend: several modest seasons and one mammoth year, hitting 274/369/496 with 31 home runs and +9 runs with his glove, combining for 7.5 WAR. Hinojosa was inconsistently great; he broke 7 WAR twice, but only had four total seasons above 5 WAR. He finished with a JONS of 35.2; excellent, but not Bronze-worthy.
A recent retiree, Rob “Racehorse” McCoy! McCoy was taken #19 overall by the Yankees in the 2028 draft. By 2030 he was considered the #1 prospect in the PBL. Over his career he was to demonstrate every single skill you’d want in a Hall of Fame player. He took a respectable number of pitches (1000+ walks in his career), made ferocious contact (career 328 BABIP), had respectable power (400+ doubles and 300+ home runs) and played all infield positions well (and truthfully, he was better at second than third). He won four Silver Sluggers, two Gold Gloves, made seven All-Star teams and won one ring (in 2035 with the Yankees). And yet.
He finished with only a 115 OPS+ over 9980 plate appearances, for a JONS of 34.1. What went wrong? Well first, he struck out a ton, never striking out less than 100 times if he started at least 102 games, so his great contact ability only led to a 270 batting average. He on-based 346, which is respectable, and his decent power bought him a modest 431 slugging. He was consistently excellent, with eight different 4+ WAR seasons and two in the 6+ range, but he was never quite as good as it seemed that he ought have been. The exception was the playoffs; over 335 postseason PA’s he hit 303/374/471, including 17 hits and 9 walks in ‘35 en route to the Yankees championship. In the playoffs “Racehorse” McCoy brought it real.
Not too many huh? Don’t worry, there are plenty of Bronze-level third basemen to learn about. Up next, Honorable Mention Shortstops!